Albert Folguera is a lawyer and tax advisor specialised in the internationalisation of companies. Closely linked to his work, he was proposed to be Consul of Denmark in Barcelona, and after accepting this proposal, Albert began to study Danish and to deepen his knowledge of Danish culture. In this interview, this lawyer observes and analyzes the Nordic business world that wants to open markets in Spain, as well as talking about Denmark, cultural differences and his Danish studies.
By Hannu Arvio
Hannu: Let’s start with Danish right away. You are at the end of the second Danish course, level A2. What are your impressions of this language?
Albert: It’s a language that when I started, people told me: “it’s very difficult, it’s very difficult”, and the truth is that it is very difficult. Not so much the grammar. I start with knowledge of English, and there are many words and grammatical constructions that sound familiar to me from English, and those who know German also say that many words sound familiar to them from German. And those who know both English and German obviously hear more words. The (grammatical) structure is very English but also German, because of the whole inversion thing. If you already know another language, it is easier. But what is hard is the ear and the pronunciation, that’s the hardest part.
Hannu: And you work on it a lot in class.
Albert: In class, the teacher speaks to us a lot in Danish, but when she sees that we are lost, she switches to Spanish. But little by little, we are making progress and we are speaking more and more in Danish. And she forces us students to say things in Danish. And the surprise has been that, as you mentioned at the beginning, now that I’m at the end of A2, we can already speak and explain things in Danish. They show you a photograph or a painting and ask you to explain what you see in Danish. You have to talk for a minute, a minute and a half, or two minutes, depending on your ability. It’s amazing.
Hannu: So you see that there has been progress and that in the future there will be progress as well.
Albert: Undoubtedly, there is incredible progress. Although I am now at the end of A2, I did an intensive course in July 2023 at the A1 level. A very intense course, with two hours of classes every day, which meant that you had to do homework at home. Homework and work, with an intense professional life, mean you have to find hours at any time. It was tough, but I knew it was four weeks. And now A2 is being much more relaxed, because it’s one day of class a week, two hours. The two hours are very intensive, but you have time to do things, to do a little bit each day. Because if you just do homework, it’s not worth studying a new language… I’m doing Danish not to do homework or to get a degree, but to learn. And the only way to learn is to do a little bit every day. They tell us that we will have progress in the future, and I hope so because if not… (laughs).
Hannu: You are a lawyer in Barcelona, specialised in the internationalisation of companies. You work in a law firm and teach at the University of Barcelona.
Albert: Correct.
Hannu: Now comes the question. So why are you studying Danish?
Albert: Well, because within my professional area, which is the internationalisation of companies and reception of foreigners in Spain, I have been able to collaborate for many years with the outgoing Consul of Denmark. And working with him, side by side on many issues, he presented me with the option of replacing him in this role of consul.
My reason for learning Danish is basically because of the new position I have started in representing Denmark in the area of Catalonia and Aragon. Was I required to learn Danish? No. But I am not only learning Danish, I am learning Danish culture. Beyond what I may have learned from working with the outgoing consul, one way to learn the culture is to learn the language. One last example: last week, in class, we were speaking Danish. But the important thing was not Danish per se, we were talking about the types of festivals and holidays and how they are celebrated in Denmark. We also commented on the appointment of the new king and his speech. We are talking about things specific to the country. Language is the excuse.
Hannu: So, somehow, for reasons of work, of responsibilities, you are placing yourself in the Danish culture.
Albert: Right. I don’t have any personal relationships: no parents, no spouse, no children who are linked to Denmark. It has been for a professional reason.
Hannu: Let’s go back to your work. What can Spain offer to a Danish or Nordic company? What kind of companies are looking for your advice to set up or start their business here?
Albert: Danish companies are attracted by the potential of the Spanish market because of the number of inhabitants. Denmark, Sweden, Norway or Finland are countries (except Denmark) with a large surface area, but with a very small population. Five, six, seven million inhabitants depending on each country. They are countries open to exports, open to the world, since their companies, with their own population, cannot generate volume. In Denmark, for example, there are large companies that have grown by opening markets abroad. Spain offers them a great opportunity, not only because of the Spanish market itself, with 48 million inhabitants, but also as a platform to enter South America. So, entering Spain, opening subsidiaries in Spain, then these subsidiaries are the ones that can drive to open market in South America due to the Spanish cultural and idiomatic issue. It is a soft landing, first to reach Spain and then South America. But only with the Spanish market… There are many Danish companies with subsidiaries in Spain.
Hannu: What kind of company is it that manages to set up shop in Spain and, subsequently, even in Latin America?
Albert: Denmark is strong in several sectors. The cases I know of are logistics, pharmaceuticals, distribution, food, wind energy, engineering companies… For example, the brewery Carlsberg. A brewery needs to expand markets, even though the market in Spain is very competitive. Another example is the pork sector. Here (in Spain) there are Danish subsidiaries that breed pigs following the same genetic guidelines as the parent company in Denmark. It is a breeding ground for research and development of new products.
Hannu: If we think the other way around, a Spanish company that is planning to go north to Denmark, what would you say to them?
Albert: That there are many business opportunities, considering that the cost of production in Spain is much lower than in any Nordic country. I know several cases of companies that have gone to Denmark to offer their services and goods. For example, a company that I have very present is a multinational that is dedicated to making wood installations in large buildings. In Sweden, Norway and Finland, there is a lot of wood, but one thing is to have the raw material and the other is to have the know-how to use it. And this company opened a base in Denmark, and from there it has opened bases in Norway and Sweden. And in all three countries, it makes large installations. It is a company that is famous for making wooden installations in large buildings, for example, in opera houses.
Hannu: Why did this company go there?
Albert: First, because of the economic situation, since they are countries with great economic capacity to be able to invest in large projects. And second, because the quality of things is perceived. We know that the Nordic countries are simple in construction, simple in life, but the quality is perceived. The Danish hyggelig concept is tried to be seen in all aspects of Danish life. It is something that here in Spain there is not; we even look for the translation of the word, and it is difficult to find an equivalent. To have things well done, just because, with harmony. And that is very interesting and very attractive for Spanish companies that want to do these things in the Nordic countries.
Hannu: In fact, there are quite a few construction companies working in the Nordic countries.
Albert: And it’s curious. Are there no Nordic construction companies? Yes, there are. So why do Spanish companies go there? Because they have sought that balance, and the initial cost is probably lower.
Hannu: What is the difficulty? Surely there are many companies thinking about going international. What is the first thing to consider? If you are doing well in your area, and you want to go, for example, to Spain, what is the important thing to think about before making the decision?
Albert: There are three questions to ask yourself: do I want to, can I, and should I? Those are the first three questions we have to ask ourselves. Do I want to internationalise? Of course! Everyone wants to sell more, and from their small town, they want to sell their product to other countries. Because you have already made an investment in your territory. A factory has a manufacturing limit, and the local market alone is not enough. So he wants to manufacture more to be able to sell abroad. That’s what it is to want to sell abroad. The next question is, can I? Do I have the necessary infrastructure to be able to offer things abroad? Of course, the will, the desire, everybody wants to sell abroad. For example, I want to sell in England, but do I know English to sell abroad? If the answer is no, then no matter how much you want to, you cannot. The last question would be, should I? Do I need to? And that’s the philosophy that every person, every entrepreneur has to think about. If you want to and you are ready, you have to analyse that willingness and see if it is really necessary or not. Then it depends on the will of each person and the risk aversion he/she has, because opening new markets costs a lot. When you are in your comfort zone, you are selling in your market, and from there you are doing… Look, I am going to give the example of Institut Nordic. Before, Institut Nordic offered face-to-face classes. What was their market? Well, it was local. After COVID, everything started online. Is Institut Nòrdic considering doing any classroom courses? Well, online is going well because you can reach more students. And I use my A1 classes as an example. In my A1 classes, the students were, for example, one from Bilbao, another from Costa Rica, another from Sant Cugat (Barcelona), I who was in Barcelona and the teacher, who was in Sant Cugat. Of course, there was a disparity of people in different territories. Is this internationalisation? Part of it. Obviously, you offer the product from here (Spain), but for Institut Nordic to reach Costa Rica, there has been a previous positioning. And now we have the Internet that allows us to position ourselves to offer these services.
Hannu: Yes, in fact, at Institut Nordic, because of COVID, we went straight to “must.”
Albert: Well, that tells me everything. That’s why everyone has to make their own strategy to know if it is necessary to internationalise. In my case, as a lawyer, I offer Spanish law. I don’t know about Danish law, and I don’t pretend to be a Danish lawyer. And what services do I offer? The confidence that when the Spaniard wants to go to Denmark, I know what things can happen to him in Spain, and I accompany him. And I make sure that with his local Danish lawyers, we make the right combination. And the other way around. When a Dane comes to Spain, which, by the way, there are many who come, and when he buys his house, he should be calm and know that from here he is properly assisted and that we coordinate with his local Danish advisor. That is our internationalisation.
Hannu: The Danish courses, that journey you’ve started with Danish culture, with the language… Has it changed any ideas you have about the Nordic countries in general?
Albert: I have had the opportunity to travel to Denmark, to Finland, to Malmö in Sweden. And it’s not that it has changed my perspective. They are really Nordic countries, but they are also European. It is true that they say that between the countries of the north and the south, there is a lot of difference, but in the end, we all have a very similar essence. We have a Christian culture, each one with its derivatives, and we have our own ways of doing things. But I have been surprised that the Danes are very trusting. First, they are very closed, but the moment they open the door to you, they have full confidence in you, unless you fail them. And that is the difference with Spain. Here, everyone is very open, but no one trusts anyone, even if it’s their brother. So that’s where I have seen a difference with Denmark. And then, the times I’ve been there, the typical difference between the north and the south. Here in the south, there is more noise, I do not say party, but there is more noise. And there, on the other hand, everything is calmer.
Hannu: Going back to the topic of internationalisation, is there anything you would like to add?
Albert: Let’s see, I have met with Danes who come to Spain and, apart from more specific issues such as the fact that there is no double taxation agreement, this accompaniment is necessary. What I say is that it is essential that they allow themselves to be accompanied, because many times they come thinking that they already know a lot, and they take the first manager they find. And it is important to have someone who knows their situation and who allows themselves to be accompanied.
Hannu: I have one last question. It is said that a large percentage of the companies that are created after two years stop working; they close. A very high percentage, 70, 80, 90%. In terms of companies that go international, can we also talk about high percentages in terms of failures and/or difficulties?
Albert: Going to another country is starting from scratch. Even if you are a big company. For example, Ikea, a large Swedish multinational. When it arrived in Spain, it was said that it had been a great success. Well, I don’t know if it was a great success. IKEA, let’s say it was selling in 10 stores in Sweden at full capacity, and it decided to open markets. But it had to test whether the products were accepted in those markets. And it opened its first store (in Spain). And it can be frustrating when a company that already sells in 10 stores in your country starts from scratch with only one outlet in a new market and has to set everything up from scratch. And for something to work, you have to spend at least 3 or 4 years, if you are successful. Because in the end, you have to think if that country is ready to receive the kind of service you offer. Are you ready to offer the service that the country needs? You have to adapt your product to the local needs. IKEA adapted, but how many Danish companies have come to offer their services and products, but there was no market? Or they did not know how to sell themselves.
